World Cup 2006

[animanic_critic]

Well there you go, another possibly-real star of England gone down the drain...

[soundchazer]

Wow...

Zizou was partying like it was 1999.. errr... 1998. Great game from the French... it was almost like those two teams changed uniforms. France at some point of the game were doing Jogo Bonito while Brazil was nowhere to be found. Incredibly poor tournament for Ronaldinho.

If France keeps playing this game, that Portugal - France match seems to be the treat for the semi-finals.

Loner: Your favored European squads peaked at the right time. THey were certainly playing better in this round of the tournament. So I guess the curse of the American/European WCs continues.

[animanic_critic]

Soundchazer, I couldn't agree more. To put it correctly, France starts peaking only when Brazil starts dipping. Zizou played like a ballet -- subtle and graceful with every move, reminiscent of his 1998 days. I won't compliment only him though; kudos to Maloudo and Ribery for width, Henry for his persistent attempts on goal and the entire defence for almost silencing the supposedly formidable offence.

... unlike the Brazilians. Seriously, they weren't playing like they did in 2002; and I'll highlight why. Ronaldinho seemed nonexistent (even his passes had flaws), unless there's provision, Ronaldo's a mere fat sitting duck, Roberto Caros' crosses were just dreadful, and the entire Brazilian defensive midfield seemed shaky (probably because Emerson was missing and the offense had to pull back).

Sigh, I actually fancied an Italy-Brazil matchup, but it just wasn't meant to be. Out went the last South American team... not to forget, the Brazilians at home must be pissed off, since they don't take defeats easily. Remember how they grilled the team back 4 years ago when they lost to France - deja vu, maybe???

[loner]

Heh, don't dismiss experience. It has proved killer so far. Germany are the only team that really lacks experience, but they play like they have that. Otherwise, Italy, Portugal and France are all very experienced teams with players who knows what they should be doing. Zidane was absolutely imperious in this game. He was untouchable. He showed Ronaldinho how it's done, how the best player in the world should play. I will really miss him now. And here I thought he was finished. And how about Patrick Vieira? Who made Ronaldinho disappear from this match? For once, Henry came through when he need to stand up and be counted.

Brazil seriously disappointed me. I always thought they just didn't play their best football, that they have another gear to switch to. Turned out that gear never existed. That was as good as it can get for Parreira's Brazil. Fork out wins against a mediocre Croatia, a horrendous Japan and two up-and-coming sides in Ghana and Australia who are just not quite there yet. They were exposed mercilessly once a real tier 1 team came. Absolutely dreadful stuff in the second half. I never thought I'd see a game where Brazil's defence played better than Brazil's attack, but there it is. If not for Juan, Brazil would've conceded a few more goals.

So there you go. That's our favorites. What a bunch of jokesters. They don't want to go home to Brazil right now. They are a murderous bunch down there right now.

[soundchazer]

In a way, I'm kind of happy it ended this way... I was sick of seeing a Brazil playing at half speed breezing to the finals every 4 years. It is sad that the last brazilian team that played nice football was also the last Brazil that didn't make it to the finals (1990... great team with a lack of good strikers).

And I'm not surprised at all... Parreira makes Brazil suck. They won in 1994 because they had 2 unbelievable strikers who were red hot at the time and could create opportunities for themselves (Bebeto and Romario) who unlike Romario, had something more than just some speed and a big frame. That team was the first of a line of boring Brazilian sides.

[animanic_critic]

Seriously, I would add, Brazil were never really impressive throughout the tournament. Can't win them all... oh, well.

SO... Germany VS Italy AND Portugal VS France -> let's see what's gonna happen now...

[sohryu]

Italy ftw.

At least, I hope so. I bet Italy a while back and I could really use the extra monies. ;x

[soundchazer]

I hope not... of the final 4, Italy is the one who plays the least attractive, like they do every 4 years, putting the bus, 11 men and a monkey to guard their net.

[sohryu]

I hope not... of the final 4, Italy is the one who plays the least attractive, like they do every 4 years, putting the bus, 11 men and a monkey to guard their net.
A bus and a monkey... that's what I've been missing.

Doc doesn't know it yet, but he's just given me my ultimate SC defense strategy.

lol, SC giving me tips for SC

* sohryu ruffles

[PsychoSaiya-jin]

Can't say I was really suprised. France picked up at the exact same time England had been promising they would. Rooney was silly for getting himself sent off but, frankly, he was overrated and the team played far better after he was sent off. Lampard just didn't get his way this whole tourney, which is a shame. Lennon was blisteringly quick and a refreshing example of what we need more of on our team. Joe Cole had some nice footwork and Andy had some good pace.
Sven's last-minute substitution made some sense, but I don't agree with it. This was meant to be his swansong as England coach, and he did do some good in his time, but he won't be as sorely missed after this.
The 4-5-1 formation never seemed to work, so it was a little odd to pesist with it. Whenever there was an opppotunity, there was nobody up the front and when on the defense, there were leaks everywhere.
The tactics of slowly creeping up to opposition never worked as the defenders always had time to fill their half. The best oppotunities came on the counter attack.

I'm predicting a France Germany Final.

[Yurika Star]

I'd of taken Lampard off instead of Joe Cole to bring on Crouch >.>

England actualy played well, and the first time they look good they lose.

Lennon was a sexy, sexy man that game. Crouch held it well and did good (My friends theory is that none of the team trust Crouch so they all play better when he's there). Hargreaves did good to, constantly defending and getting in better positions than his two attacking midfield friends. Are defense played well to, Ashely Cole was always doing his job and doing it well.

And I wish we hadn't been starting Beckham :( Been hoping for something to shake it up for ages, and it never happened. We had two AM's who didn't pull it off like they can, no pace on the right. And I don't think Rooney can play alone. But Sven persists as ever!

It just didn't click at the right time, ohh well!

So, farewell Sven (Finaly!!!). And don't hate on Rooney, he is not a disgrace. He has a firey spirit, everyone knows that, and when he had 2 players gangraping him for 5 seconds he got annoyed.

Zizou can still do it. And Brazil, like England, never clicked either.

[soundchazer]

Pffft... firey spirit my ass... stomping on someone's crown jewels is total breakdown of fair play. He is a thug in a football uniform. He should had been arrested with the rest of those hooligans they caught the other day, because he is just like them.

[loner]

I'll just say that it comes with the package. Rooney will become one of the world's best players (he probably already is), but that temper was there ever since he came into prominence. I remember him geting a red card earlier this season for same kind of temper outbursts. Of course he needs to learn that stomping on Carvalho's important areas is not a good idea. However, remember he's still a kid, and a lot of great players, Maradona especially, have very fiery tempers as well.

[Nicotine]

Of course he needs to learn that stomping on Carvalho's important areas is not a good idea. However, remember he's still a kid, of

"Kids" way younger then him know not to do that. >_>

I'm not going to lie though. I'm a little disappointed that Brazil lost...it's just kind of strange to me to not see them in the finals because every world cup I've seen they've been there. But they know they played badly in this Cup. Cocky maybe? I feel bad for Argentina too...they were *so* close. I think it will be Germany vs France too...but I don't think Italy vs France is not a possible.

[animanic_critic]

Rooney will be just like Beckham of the younger days -- talented but hot-headed. His success will be affected, starting with preventing Cavarlho from having Father's Day after that, if you know what I mean...

[PsychoSaiya-jin]

Pffft... firey spirit my ass... stomping on someone's crown jewels is total breakdown of fair play. He is a thug in a football uniform. He should had been arrested with the rest of those hooligans they caught the other day, because he is just like them.
As far as I know, it was him pushing C.Ronaldo right infront of the ref while the arguing took place that landed him a red card. Dissent (sp?) was the charge.

[loner]

Nicotine, kids much younger than him won't get sandwiched by two big Portuguese defenders after being forced to win glory for his nation all on his own after just coming back from a very serious injury. The pressure felt by this kid is such that very few could ever experience. That of course give him no excuse to do that, but it's not hard to imagine someone this young snapping after such prolonged periods of heavy pressure and frustration.

PSJ, I think it was a combination of stepping on Carvalho, pushing Ronaldo and whatever came out of his mouth that got him a red card. He lost it all in that short period of time, giving the ref not many other options.

[animanic_critic]

I don't know just what Ronaldo said to the referee, but even if he hadn't done it, Rooney would still have been sent off. Remember, Rooney always had this reputation on his temper. One time he may be brilliant, while another time he may be just plain stupid.

Not all players would do the same thing as he did in such a tight situation. He just doesn't know how to control himself sometimes.

P.S. Do you notice that in every major recent tournaments, England have always been eliminated controversionally? In 2002, Ronaldinho gave that outrageous free kick and in 2004, Sol Campbell was denied a goal due to foul.

[Ai-chan]

I've always supported Italy and Germany.But thrs gonna be Italy vs Germany.so im in a dilemma.T-T...sigh...dunno which to support.though its x impossible for italy to win against Germany,still,i'd love to see Germany won the world cup.i wish Lippy would let Filippo Inzaghi play this time.It's waste that him being subtitute n watch the game from th bench only.I can almost say that he never failed to score whenever he's out there.

[kLaUS]

So, the world cup is almost over and now are the semifinals, just 4 teams left.
Im still with germany, italy hasnt been playing their best football, so i dont think this is gonna be a difficult match. In the other side, i would go with france , but portugal has surprise everyone getting this far...

Anyway, here are my final predictions

1. GERMANY
2. France
3. Italy
4. Portugal

GO GERMANY GO !!!!

[animanic_critic]

So, the world cup is almost over and now are the semifinals, just 4 teams left.
Im still with germany, italy hasnt been playing their best football, so i dont think this is gonna be a difficult match. In the other side, i would go with france , but portugal has surprise everyone getting this far...

Anyway, here are my final predictions

1. GERMANY
2. France
3. Italy
4. Portugal

GO GERMANY GO !!!!
I'm not a supporter of any of the remaining teams here since I support the Dutch XO. I don't mean to offend an avid German supporter, but it will be very interesting to see Portugal actually winning the World Cup (hard for me to say since they kicked out Holland).

Portugal is the only team that hasn't won the World Cup, and if they do win the tournament, then Luiz Filippe Scolari will be the only coach that have won the World Cup consecutively with two different national teams. Just think of the prospects, ooh...

[loner]

I've always supported Italy and Germany.But thrs gonna be Italy vs Germany.so im in a dilemma.T-T...sigh...dunno which to support.though its x impossible for italy to win against Germany,still,i'd love to see Germany won the world cup.i wish Lippy would let Filippo Inzaghi play this time.It's waste that him being subtitute n watch the game from th bench only.I can almost say that he never failed to score whenever he's out there.

I would love to see Pippo out there just so he could entertain me with his overdramatic antics when the ref calls him offside for the 20th time. Seriously though, Pippo is perfect at scoring garbage goals. If you really desperately need a goal after pressuring the opponent for half an hour but to no avail because your other strikers can't finish worth damn. He's a great finisher. But he is also perhaps the most selfish striker in the world and always get offside. You can actually say for sure that he's never failed to score when he's out there in the World Cup, because he has only been out there for 1 game against the Czechs, and scored a typical garbage goal when the Czechs were only playing 2 defenders. That goal actually showed his typical selfishness. It was a 2-on-0 break, Pippo had the ball with another guy next to him. Petr Cech, perhaps knowing Pippo's reputation, went after Pippo immediately and ignored the other guy, while Pippo well, ignored the other guy as well even though he's in a much better position. Pippo scored, but Cech almost saved that. If Pippo didn't score that, the other guy probably would've beaten him up in the locker room.

Anyways, Italy has a formation that works. Inzaghi as a lone forward would be the worst idea ever, and anyways, Luca Toni is a much more complete striker. Pippo off the bench can also have a much better effect than Pippo starting.

[animanic_critic]

I would love to see Pippo out there just so he could entertain me with his overdramatic antics when the ref calls him offside for the 20th time. Seriously though, Pippo is perfect at scoring garbage goals. If you really desperately need a goal after pressuring the opponent for half an hour but to no avail because your other strikers can't finish worth damn. He's a great finisher. But he is also perhaps the most selfish striker in the world and always get offside. You can actually say for sure that he's never failed to score when he's out there in the World Cup, because he has only been out there for 1 game against the Czechs, and scored a typical garbage goal when the Czechs were only playing 2 defenders. That goal actually showed his typical selfishness. It was a 2-on-0 break, Pippo had the ball with another guy next to him. Petr Cech, perhaps knowing Pippo's reputation, went after Pippo immediately and ignored the other guy, while Pippo well, ignored the other guy as well even though he's in a much better position. Pippo scored, but Cech almost saved that. If Pippo didn't score that, the other guy probably would've beaten him up in the locker room.

Anyways, Italy has a formation that works. Inzaghi as a lone forward would be the worst idea ever, and anyways, Luca Toni is a much more complete striker. Pippo off the bench can also have a much better effect than Pippo starting.
Pippo is a world-class striker, I can tell, because you can trust that he will do whatever it takes to score, even if it means an unclinical or scruffy goal... A goal's a goal to him. Luca Toni's good but I don't know whether he has the class to score in crunch matches or in tight situations... we'll see.

[sakura_blossom]

Right at the end of the game with 27 minutes into overtime and Italy scored over Germany! Wow, that was a great game, both teams did a remarkable job and both deserved to go to the finals at this point.

Now since Italy is in the finals and the Portugal vs. France game still has to be played, I'm going to predict that in the finals it'll be Italy vs. France.

So when it comes down to the finals, it should be a great match. I'm looking forward to seeing Italy win, but hey I won't give my hopes up. But that's not going to keep me from still cheering.

GO ITALY!

[PsychoSaiya-jin]

Good football. Normally I'd have wanted Germany to go through but the last-minute goal scored was great and cannot be denied. There was an all-out counter attack that failed unfortunetly. The second goal was great but a death to Germany's world cup hopes.
Alot of praise has gone to the referee, who managed to keep the players under control nicely but not handing out cards. Something to be learnt form perhaps?

[animanic_critic]

WOW!!! Now that has to be the best match of the World Cup... and then some!

Italy and Germany were almost EQUAL, until a brilliance from Iaquinta's curl ball blew Germany away! Praises to Germany, but salutations to Cannavaro, Buffon and Iaquinta for their undying efforts! Bravo!!!

[soundchazer]

Good football. Normally I'd have wanted Germany to go through but the last-minute goal scored was great and cannot be denied. There was an all-out counter attack that failed unfortunetly. The second goal was great but a death to Germany's world cup hopes.
Alot of praise has gone to the referee, who managed to keep the players under control nicely but not handing out cards. Something to be learnt form perhaps?


Armando Archundia has been the best Mexican referee for years now, and he likes to keep matches as clean of cards as possible. I thought he had a great performance today. Didn't fall for diving plays which made players use that resource less often than in other matches.

As far as the match goes, it is funny that the overtime was more fun than the first 90 minutes. I think the victory came to the rightful team, as Italy was more dangerous than Germany. Hats off to Cannavaro, that man is just a human wall. And both goals were just about as pretty as you can see... it was nice watching Italy actualy creating instead of destroying... it suits them better.

Animanic: It was not Iaquinta... it was Grosso. Spectacular kicking technique, specially coming from a defender. Iaquinta was the one who gave the pass.

[animanic_critic]

Armando Archundia has been the best Mexican referee for years now, and he likes to keep matches as clean of cards as possible. I thought he had a great performance today. Didn't fall for diving plays whi made players use that resource less often than in other matches.

As far as the match goes, it is funny that the overtime was more fun than the first 90 minutes. I think the victory came to the rightful team, as Italy was more dangerous than Germany. Hats off to Cannavaro, that mas is just a human wall.

Animanic: It was not Iaquinta... it was Grosso. Spectacular kicking technique, specially coming from a defender. Iaquinta was the one who gave the pass.

Oops! My bad (they look alike, don't they?) - salutations to Grosso's outrageous left-foot curl ball! That would have made Roberto Carlos blush. Italy crushed the German spirit with Del Piero's LAST LAST minute goal. Hmm Hmm Hmm (Shaking head in awe...)

[loner]

SC, the guy who made the pass was actually Andreas Pirlo. He won the man of the match, and clearly deserved it. People talk about Totti all the time when the heart of the team is actually Pirlo. He is what Italy was missing in 2002, a perfect anchor midfielder who can make any kind of pass with perfect precision. The closest player Germany has to Pirlo is Frings, and he is well, you know. Sebastian Kehl played an excellent game as his replacement and kept Totti completely out of the game, but he does not have Frings' ability of turning defence into attack.

And yes, Fabio Grosso. I don't like him much for his diving tendencies, but you must give him credit. That's the second time he pulled Italy through in the dying minutes of a game. Aussies will remember him for his outrageous dive to win that penalty, but you have to admire his ability to get into the box in the first place. He was all alone against 2 Aussie defenders, yet he somehow found his way through. And in this game, again he came out of nowhere to whip a perfect curving shot from the RIGHT side of the box with his RIGHT foot. He is a LEFT back. He will definitely leave for a big club, most likely Inter, after the WC, and become one of the world's premier left backs.

Germany fought hard throughout this tournament, and should be lauded for their effort. Still, in the last moment, they lost concentration. You just can't do that against the Italians. David Odonkor was marking the post when the corner was taken, but for some reason he wandered out to mark absolutely no one. If he stayed there, he would've blocked that shot. Inexperience finally counted against this young German squad. Still, if Klinsmann is allowed to stay as national coach, he will guide these youngsters into great players, and they've suddenly turned from a great team in demise to a young team on the rise.

Italy will now consider themselves as the favorites. Their defence, led by the awesome Cannavaro, is like SC said a human wall. And the scary thing is, if Nesta comes back, it will be even better. Materazzi did very well to keep Klose out of the game, but Cannavaro have much better understanding with Nesta, his international partner for a decade now. And behind them, there is the best keeper in the world, Gigi Buffon, who has only conceded one goal to his own teammate Cristian Zaccardo (he can't be human if he can save that). They may look clueless in attack sometimes, but they have geniuses like Pirlo on the team who can create something out of nothing. Totti serves as a good decoy. They are a worthy finalist on this display, and they will be very dangerous in the finals. Remember there's the added incentive of the scandal. Of the 11 who started, 9 players are from clubs that are currently being put on trial. They will want to prove something, that they are for real, and they also want their people to start believing and loving football again.

[Domi]

Portugal v France
who win?
I think PORTUGAL win in this match :headbang:

[animanic_critic]

Portugal v France
who win?
I think PORTUGAL win in this match :headbang:
I agree with you. Although France has that class despite their ageing squad, but I wanna see a team that has never won the cup to advance. Portugal's main strength has always been Scolari, unlike France whose strength lies in their players themselves. Let's see what Scolari has in store for us and the Frenchmen...:D

P.S. Andreas Pirlo may have won the Man of the Match, but to me, Cannavaro was my Man of the Match. His defending skills simply blew me away with his tackles and interceptions.

To Domi: Keep up the English. You're doing just fine!

[kLaUS]

god, that was some match yesterday, i have to admit that i was more nervous that in the argentina`s match, because italy had some much more control of the game, i guess that the best did won...

Anyway , not that i care now but, its probably true that portugal will win this match today, although im with zidane, he deserves (zidane , not france)...

[Nicotine]

I don't think the PK was deserved. Meh, can't go back now. It's not like Portugal didn't have any chances.

[animanic_critic]

*Sigh* I really thought Scolari would have a brilliant plan up his sleeve, but I guess that the classy Frenchmen were just too overwhelming for the Portuguese. Interesting if Portugal were to win though...

... but I can't blame them for losing. Somehow, I always knew that the usual suspect Zidane will be on the scoresheet sooner or later. I'm not surprised that France eventually won though; many people predicted that anyway.

For now, let's see who will get the 3rd spot up in the tournament - Germany or Portugal...?

[Kuzu Ryu Sen]

I don't think Scolari could have done much else. Portugal had the bulk of the play, but just couldn't finish to save their lives. Much the story for them the whole tournament.

1 v Angola, 2 v Iran, 2 v Mexico (one on a gift PK), 1 v Holland, 0 v England.

Not that stellar for a team of that calibre.

Based on performances, if Germany can get over the crushing heartbreak, I see them beating the Portuguese handily.

[loner]

Scolari could only do so much for this team. He got the tactics right. France did almost nothing in the second half and had very few shots on goal. What Scolari couldn't do is make his sterile strikers prolific. He is a national coach, and there is not much time for him to work on the basics with his players while devising plans to win international games after all. And Portugal just don't have any good striker. Pauleta, their record goal scorer and usually the top scorer of French Ligue 1, has suddenly become the disappearing act in recent major international tournaments. Except for the first 4 minutes of his tournament, Pauleta was basically invisible. However, Scolari was forced to start him because of lack of alternatives. Nuno Gomes was good 6 years ago, but now he's past it; Helder Postiga remains one of the biggest jokes in English Premiership history; Luis BoaMorte is not really a striker but a winger. In the end, he was forced to play 4-6-0. That works when you are trying to kill games off and play counter attack, but when you are chasing a game against one of the world's best defences, you are not going to get anything.

Scolari is still a winner for getting this team this far. Normally they would've just stumbled out in the group stages.

Penalty is legit. Carvalho left his foot out. You might say Henry could've still stood up, but that point is moot: any striker will fall in that circumstance. The rules protect the attacking players, especially "artists" like Henry. Any ref will call a penalty there.

[PsychoSaiya-jin]

Fantastic football from the host team today. Their 3rd place was well-earnt.
Was this the first hat-trick of the tournament or was the second counted as own-goal?
I'm hoping for some big fireworks in tomorrow's final.

[Moe]

GO FRANCE!!!!!!

[animanic_critic]

Fantastic football from the host team today. Their 3rd place was well-earnt.
Was this the first hat-trick of the tournament or was the second counted as own-goal?
I'm hoping for some big fireworks in tomorrow's final.
Nope, it's not a hat-trick because Petit (I think it's him) clearly helped Schweinsteinger's free kick into his own goal post. I had no idea what he was trying to do back then. His other two goals, though brilliant, were just carbon copies of each other.

The first half was quite listless, but boy, things started to pick up on the second. Cristiano Ronaldo was talented but disgraceful (that guy should represent Portugal in the Olympics diving) and Oliver Kahn did a wonderful job despite the late minute goal from Nuno Gomes (can't be helped). We'll surely miss the outspoken goalkeeper...

I knew Germany would win, because Portugal hadn't score in the last 3 matches. Anyway, it was an entertaining, and quite a sad match because this will be the last time we'll see the ageing stars hang up their boots such as Luis Figo, Oliver Kahn and Costinha.

Well, with that done and done, let's see who'll win the big cheese: I'm banking on Italy to clinch the title.

VIVA ITALIA!!!

[loner]

Well, Schweinsteiger's goals weren't exactly carbon copies, though he did hit them at the same spot. His first goal was going to the far post, but the ball suddenly curved inward, tricking Ricardo and landing in the middle of the net. His second goal curved straight into the corner of the far post, fooling Ricardo yet again.

A deserved win for Germany. Portugal showed their inability to hit the back of the net yet again. They have great midfielders and show some great passing, but they can't finish worth shit. That's why they can't get to the finals, not all the booing Crissy gets or the ref going against them.

[Azazis]

Portugals team should stop footballing and start ballet. They're better at flailing and falling like little girls then showing some quality football.

[Kuzu Ryu Sen]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82ochcQ56Es&search=ronaldo%20germany

Disgraceful.

[animanic_critic]

Now really, what has happened to graceful footballing these days? I don't remember diving to be a fad or trend back during the 2002 World Cup. Sure, there were diving back then such Totti's, but diving wasn't really an issue. Nowadays, it's like diving is somewhat OKAY!

What's up with that? What's their reason for diving? Being pushed? Avoid injury? COME ON, PLEASE!!!!

[loner]

I kinda think diving has become a big deal in this World Cup mainly because people made it so, not exactly because there have been more diving incidents in 2006 than in 2002 or 1998, or any other World Cups. Especially the British media who, after seeing their "greatest generation" getting knocked out by the Portuguese and unwilling to put the blame on themselves, decided to villify the Portuguese and especially Cristiano Ronaldo. Not to say that the Portuguese aren't guilty of this, and as one article from Soccernet said, they are actually especially bad at diving that everybody notices immediately. But the thing is, they aren't the only team that is doing this. Pretty much every team has a few divers, including the British themselves.

The funny thing is that Portugal actually got nothing but keep on getting screwed for their diving. They messed up a lot of their scoring chances because they thought of falling down first. And the refs especially targetted them for their reputation and won't give any call in their favor. Even Ronaldo's "playacting" to ask for the red card to be given to Rooney, obliged by the ref, didn't really do Portugal any favor either, since England actually had the better of the game after that and looked more likely to score than before Rooney got sent off.

In fact, for all those these universal damnations of Portugal, the ultimate irony is that the teams that actually truly benifited from diving are the two finalists facing off tonight.

So all I can say is, yeah, Portugal's diving is disgraceful, but look at your own teams first. They are not the only ones doing it. And instead of complaining, the media needs to actually do something, like urging FIFA and the FAs to hand out tougher punishments to divers. Football academies also need to educate their youngsters about diving.

[animanic_critic]

FIFA President Sepp Blatter had already proposed a firmer crackdown on divers, which is okay. But with this in mind, doesn't this inadvertently result in referees becoming too, I don't know, biased or strict. I say this because what if referees will become less rewarding because they now believe that players will do whatever it take to get advantages. Rather than players falling down for real, referees could start thinking of forking out more cards than a poker game!

Isn't that why referees tend to flash out the cards more than they should - because they want to crack down on foul play? FIFA, by all means, can do whatever they want to eliminate foul play, but what worries me is that now foul play is not exactly foul play. It's becoming more common for every player, and that worries me as a football fan, with all the "What has happened" instead of "What could have happened".

This really is becoming a huge issue. The media isn't really helping at all as well. Quite ironic though, since a few matches before, FIFA Fair Play was encouraged...

[loner]

And that's why I believe that technology needs to be introduced. Referees are only human and are prone to mistakes, but cameras won't lie. It would be the simplest solution, and something no player can argue against. With today's technology, a detailed recap can be produced extremely fast, so consulting technology won't stall the game much more than it already is. It's ridiculous not to do it, since it's already part of every other sport, and it actually is already a huge part of football. I mean, what's better, consulting the video recaps on the spot and make a right decision, or make a wrong decision based on human intuition and see the recap the next morning on every major newspaper, news channels and website ridiculing that decision?

[PsychoSaiya-jin]

http://youtube.com/watch?v=zKUV0JIqVnY&search=football%20dive
http://youtube.com/watch?v=BrvRGTVkv6Y&mode=related&search=football%20dive

and
http://youtube.com/watch?v=Pi26wvO1DWg&mode=related&search=football%20dive

[isolatedotaku]

Zidane, you idiot! Have some class. That was really disappointing to see, I wouldn't be suprised if they lost now without him.

EDIT//

Yeah, they lost. Damn it.

[Ritalin]

Zidane, you idiot! Have some class. That was really disappointing to see, I wouldn't be suprised if they lost now without him.

I don't give a flying **** about soccer but when I saw that on my TV in the corner of my eye I laughed my ass off.

That dude is brilliant. Perfect way to retire.

[Dtortot]

WTF Zidane?

The game was... OK. The second half was better and it is a shame it needed penatlies to be decided. So unfair.

[soundchazer]

And that's why I believe that technology needs to be introduced. Referees are only human and are prone to mistakes, but cameras won't lie. It would be the simplest solution, and something no player can argue against. With today's technology, a detailed recap can be produced extremely fast, so consulting technology won't stall the game much more than it already is. It's ridiculous not to do it, since it's already part of every other sport, and it actually is already a huge part of football. I mean, what's better, consulting the video recaps on the spot and make a right decision, or make a wrong decision based on human intuition and see the recap the next morning on every major newspaper, news channels and website ridiculing that decision?


The problem is the sports that use it usually are the type that have stoppage for advertisements. Soccer has no such luxury (nor would I want to see a 2 minute stoppage time to check a specific play). One of the beauty of the game is that unless there is an injury, you don't stop at all. I would hate for soccer to become hacked every 3 minutes like American Football is. I hate going into commercials so often.

They would have to make it on the go, and I don't think replays can work like that.


Zidane: way to blow your last game.

[Linuts]

Haha, I just had to watch the final because of the office Soccer pool :D. Yay! Italy won!

But WTF was that Zidane doing? I didn't quite catch that. What lead to the argument and the ultimate headbutt?

Oh, and that one penalty kick the France lost... That was one unlucky shot...

[loner]

The problem is the sports that use it usually are the type that have stoppage for advertisements. Soccer has no such luxury (nor would I want to see a 2 minute stoppage time to check a specific play). One of the beauty of the game is that unless there is an injury, you don't stop at all. I would hate for soccer to become hacked every 3 minutes like American Football is. I hate going into commercials so often.

They would have to make it on the go, and I don't think replays can work like that.


Zidane: way to blow your last game.

Yeah, but with the stoppages with the complaining and the diving player feigning injuries and all that jazz, we already have long stoppages anyways. I think video replays should only be used in vital decisions. With diving now becoming such a big topic, it is impossible to really solve it without the help of technology. Harsher punishments for diving may have some good effects, but in big games like World Cups, players will dive anyways if it meant their team have the chance of winning. And as it is, it's destroying the game far more than any technical stoppages could.

So yeah, the final. It was a pretty good game, but everybody is predictably talking about Zidane. It's a sad way to go out. I can offer this defence for him: Materazzi is one of the most vicious and annoying pest in world football. Still, Zidane as the model professional shouldn't be doing something like that, not in a World Cup final in extra time. Not in your last ever professional game. So, plenty of drama for sure, and this sorta turned into the Zidane and Materazzi Show. But here's some more interesting facts:

- David Trezeguet scored the Golden Goal winner in 2000 that won the Euro for France against Italy. He turned out to be the only Frenchman to miss a penalty.
- That was Fabio Cannavaro's 100 cap, Italy's captain and best defender in the world perhaps. A World Cup on your 100 cap.
- Fabio Grosso won the penalty that took Italy through the round of 16. He scored the dramatic ET goal that took Italy through the semifinals. And he scored the final penalty that won the World Cup for Italy in the final. Who would've thought he would be the hero of this World Cup?
- Italy went out on penalties in 1990, 1994 and 1998. No more penalty pains today. They also avenged the 1998 penalty heartbreak to this French team.
- Italy last won the World Cup 24 years ago. In that year, their football league was also stricken by corruption scandals, as they are going through right now.

Well, it's been a fun month. And now we start counting down the four years again....

[PsychoSaiya-jin]

Zidane threw away victory and everything else. Shame. I feel sorry for Bartez and Trezeguet.
Its been a fun month, hats off to the hosts.

[Niner]

I don't give a flying **** about soccer but when I saw that on my TV in the corner of my eye I laughed my ass off.

That dude is brilliant. Perfect way to retire.
^

I'm with her. Silly Italian man probably insulted Zidane's mum's cooking or something. Silly soccer.

So glad this whole thing is over so I can stop hearing about it everywhere I go.

[darylcrowe]

Well, it's been a fun month. And now we start counting down the four years again....

Or count down two years for Euro 2008 (by the way, who's hosting that?)

[soundchazer]

Or one year until the next Copa America.

By the way, I don't buy that Zidane, the ultimate professional thing. He was already shown a red card in 1998 for stomping on someone else during the first match. While he is usually cool, when he is hot headed he makes themost stupid decisions. He didn't even go out to get his medal when the match was over.

[darylcrowe]

Or one year until the next Copa America.

By the way, I don't buy that Zidane, the ultimate professional thing. He was already shown a red card in 1998 for stomping on someone else during the first match. While he is usually cool, when he is hot headed he makes themost stupid decisions. He didn't even go out to get his medal when the match was over.
I think Zidane wasn't allow to collect it.

[animanic_critic]

Or one year until the next Copa America.

By the way, I don't buy that Zidane, the ultimate professional thing. He was already shown a red card in 1998 for stomping on someone else during the first match. While he is usually cool, when he is hot headed he makes themost stupid decisions. He didn't even go out to get his medal when the match was over.
Anyone shown a red card CANNOT go out to receive his respective medal, regardless of the situation. And it's better it doesn't, because he would be putting his people to shame with what he just did.

THE FINALS IS OVER!!!! ITALY won as I thought! The penalty given to France was a little too harsh, and dammit, Zidane made an idiot out of Buffon with that audacious penalty kick. Good thing Materazzi, the one who gave away that penalty, got Italy right back on track with his header. I don't know if anyone noticed, but as the game progresses, France began to look more jaded -- Zidane got slower, Vieira injured himself, Henry was switched to Trezeguet and Zidane blew his top off!

What a nerve-wrecking penalty shootout! If only Henry stayed on, he could have prevented France from losing instead of Trezeguet. Sigh, nobody's fault, I guess. But I'm still sooo happy Italy won, because now they have their own moment to savour ahead of their scandal back home.

...ahh, the game's finally over. That was the last time we're gonna see stars hang up their boots for good such as Patrick Vieira, Zinedine Zidane, Thierry Henry (maybe), David Trezeguet, Lilian Thuram, Claude Makelele, Fabian Barthez, Willy Sagnol, Francesco Totti, Alessandro Nesta, Fabio Cannavaro (that man rocks, literally!!!), Gianluca Zambrotta, and the list goes on... I said it once and I'll say it again:

VIVA WORLD CUP CHAMPIONS ITALY!!!

P.S. What's up with Zidane? Someone so kind in nature did something so stupid in such a critical game!? What a shameful way to retire!!! Care to discuss on this?

[animanic_critic]

Or count down two years for Euro 2008 (by the way, who's hosting that?)
Yo, the European Football Championships 2008 will be held in Austria-Switzerland from 07 June to 29 June, the second joint-host in Euro history other than Belgium-Netherlands back in Euro 2000.

P.S. Technology should REALLY be considered in making important decisions in football. Sometimes people's dreams and efforts could be shattered just because of a referee's foolish decisions. You don't want that to happen to you if you're a football player yourself, now do you???

[Daravon]

I think the one offsides they called on Italy was not offsides. I'm all for using technology to ref these things. The cameras can have a perfect angle to determine if a player is offsides while the server slowmotion serves it, a luxury that the onfield ref cannot have.

I mean the TV announcer was saying at first that the Zidane headbutt was not seen by the onfield ref so it would not be called, even though they were showing replays of it. And that oh, the ref is now claiming that he saw it so it will be called. Why does it matter if he saw it at all? Trust us we all know refs aren't perfect, closer scrutiny wouldn't tragically remove our confidence in them by exposing their fallibility. Just because the ref didn't see it doesn't mean that it didn't happen! That's like in Oh Brother Where Art Thou when delmar was like 'it done went out over the radio!' and the policeman was like 'well, we ain't got a radio'. Like that changes the fact that it did.

I also think baseball desperately needs an objective system for determining strikes, optical, ultrasound, or otherwise. Hell I could cook one up with a few bucks worth of parts from Mouser and Labview. I'm tired of subjectivity in sports these days with millions of dollars on the line and world audiences.

[oompa loompa]

where is the next WC? Great way to retire Zidane, good job Germany keepin it in the top 3, C.ronaldo is leaving england dont care, the italians are just happy they wern't caught this time*recent events in italian soccer*

[soundchazer]

I'm not against technology, mind you, but against technology that will change the nature of the game. I don't mind GPS tracking of the ball, maybe even include chips in the player's shows so the technology will let the referees know if there was offsides or not, but I certainly am against replays.

Replays will change the nature of the game. It would kill momentum in matches, and make transmitions become close to 3 hours like american football. You also have to keep in mind that players only dispute 1 or 2 calls per match, so they won't lose as much time as what a referee would if he had to go towards a monitor every 5 minutes.

It is not bad calls that are killing the game (we have had a huge amount of those since the 60's), but the lack of scoring in the World Cups. Maybe giving incentives to the highets scoring team could do the trick. Maybe if the monetary prizes were higher for the highest scoring team than those of the champion, maybe some teams would be more inclined to be looking to defend less and attack more.

[isolatedotaku]

I think Zidane wasn't allow to collect it.

It was never said (or atleast not on ABC) that Zidane wasn't allowed to collect the metal, but that he did not want to come out or his coachs made him stay in the locker room. It will be extremely interesting to find out what was said to Zidane to make him snap like that, because he was walking away when something made him turn around.

[animanic_critic]

where is the next WC? Great way to retire Zidane, good job Germany keepin it in the top 3, C.ronaldo is leaving england dont care, the italians are just happy they wern't caught this time*recent events in italian soccer*
The next World Cup in 2010 will be held in the sunny (VERY sunny) country of South Africa. Wonder how they're gonna accomodate all the football players and the hordes of supporters & spectators? Hmm...:3huh:

[Moe]

well with bad calls from the ref and 30 min of over time and penalty shots, in the end italy won... all in all it was still a good game.

[Nicotine]

WTF Zidane?

The game was... OK. The second half was better and it is a shame it needed penatlies to be decided. So unfair.

How was that unfair? I guess the only unfair thing was when they called offsides on Italy's goal. But it doesn't really matter seeing as they one anyway. France played a better game I think, though. I guess they lost some of their spirits after Zidane decided to be an idiot. I have to admit it though, I burst out laughing went I saw that. It was so stupid.

Oh well. Congrats Italy. Nice to see someone win besides Brazil. :D

[ShinoMatrix]

I felt that Brazil was never really in full form this entire World Cup tournament... would have wanted them to win, but meh, what are you gonna do...

I wonder how those suspended sentences/hearings are going to go now for the Italians :p

[loner]

Those sentences will probably mean that most of the players you saw in this final will leave their clubs and find a new one elsewhere. Perhaps the biggest exodus of great players in football history.

Luca Toni was offside, however marginal. And don't believe what ABC said, because once you get a red card, you're not allowed back on the pitch, and certainly not allowed to collect a medal.

And animanic_critic, of all of the players you mentioned, only Zidane is retiring for good. Thuram and Makelele may retire from international football, but you'll still see them around playing for the top clubs in Europe. I don't know what is going to happen to Barthez, but the rest of the players you mentioned are still in their prime and will definitely keep on playing.

SC, I thought not many people care about Copa America now, especially since Brazil and Argentina have been sending under-strength squads for the last two tournaments.

[Tsukushi]

:whine: Boohoo! The World Cup is already over. Another four years.... What a final though! It's a pity it went to the penalty shots. Both teams could have scored one or two more goals :) And Zizou who screwed-up.... What a pity. I'm sure the Italian guy said something extremely nasty to him for such a reaction. Anyway, I was for France, better luck next time.

[Kuzu Ryu Sen]

well with bad calls from the ref and 30 min of over time and penalty shots, in the end italy won... all in all it was still a good game.

Care to elaborate on these "bad calls"?

[animanic_critic]

Well, seeing Zidane, one of the greats of our generation, being sent off like that really leaves a bitter taste to his illustrious career... but the bigger issue here WHY HE DID SUCH A THING...?

People speculated that Materazzi said such a thing that spurred Zidane to headbutt him, but what in the world could he have said? Zidane has yet to justify his actions to the press... Is he feeling guilty or feeling that testifying will do no good? Maybe he hasn't done so because testifying will further open a big can of worms...

Anything you heard about Zidane incident, please discuss... Zidane is one of my favourites. Good thing he received the Golden Ball award though.

[Finnf00]

Well, seeing Zidane, one of the greats of our generation, being sent off like that really leaves a bitter taste to his illustrious career... but the bigger issue here WHY HE DID SUCH A THING...?

People speculated that Materazzi said such a thing that spurred Zidane to headbutt him, but what in the world could he have said? Zidane has yet to justify his actions to the press... Is he feeling guilty or feeling that testifying will do no good? Maybe he hasn't done so because testifying will further open a big can of worms...Heard this in our local news today. According to an unknown source Materazzi called Zidane a musilm terrorist or something which in some grave way insluted his faith.

In truth, I think it was the appropriate exit for this hot tempered maestro. At least he got to win everything possible in football. There are a lot of great players who never managed to win a single award, let alone a world cup. Being red carded to end his career might seem sad, but at least he´ll be remembered now.

[loner]

It is not bad calls that are killing the game (we have had a huge amount of those since the 60's), but the lack of scoring in the World Cups. Maybe giving incentives to the highets scoring team could do the trick. Maybe if the monetary prizes were higher for the highest scoring team than those of the champion, maybe some teams would be more inclined to be looking to defend less and attack more.

Sorry, but I don't buy that. Football is a team sport. Attack and defence are equally important parts of the game. If every team went gung-ho and forget about defending, and we have scorelines like 5-4 every game, then the game will really be killed. There may be more goals, but the quality will undoubtedly go down. There needs to be a balance, and personally I'm glad to see this kind of balance at this World Cup. I'm not an advocate of total catenaccio displayed by the Greeks in Euro 04, but that kind of play was not at show in this World Cup. The teams most alike Greece in the WC were Serbia and Croatia, and both flopped. Meanwhile, the teams that left a good impression all had good balances of efficient defending and attacking flair. These are teams that may not score shitloads of goals, but they score good, well-thought, smart, high quality goals.

After all this is the highest stage of football, with not just high standard attack but also high standard defending. If you want to see rugbylike scores, go to see some lower division games in your local leagues. I'm sure those are fun in their own ways, but that's not what World Cup is about.

If FIFA went ahead with your idea, then a team with fantastic attackers that score huge amount of goals, even though they defend worse than schoolboys and concede twice as much goals and lose every single game, will still end up being the real winners? Is that fair to players like Cannavaro and Thuram, whose high quality defending skills and intelligence actually win games for their teams? Football needs Cannavaros and Thurams as much as Zidanes, Ronaldos and Henrys.

[soundchazer]

you forget one thing... it is the Zidanes and Ronaldos who sell tickets and keep people interested. That is why FIFA is considering widening the goal area (horrible idea if you ask me).

Yes... good defenders are great and all, but people go to the stadiums to see people score and have good attacking teamwork.

And for the record, soccer became popular during those times were scores were 5-4 or 7-2 or 4-2. No one denied the quality of a good attacking team ever. Just because you are a little more gung ho about it, doesn't meant that the quality will be absent. Just look at any of the Brazilian teams of the 60's and 1970.

[Moe]

it sounds like we should have a... REMATCH!!!!


edit: i hope you guys know i meant this as a joke...

[kLaUS]

it sounds like we should have a... REMATCH!!!!
edit: i hope you guys know i meant this as a joke...

is not really that fun when you have to explain that is a joke...

So italy won, even thought they didnt play as a world champion team, the final match was a little boring.. and yeah, is not really that fair when the final definition is made with penalties.

what i still dont get, is how someone can finish his career in that way, not only in his last match proffesionally, but in the final at a world cup ?¿!!, but well, after all, i wasnt that surprise, zidane has been know as a little agressive and if im not mistaken, this is not the first match where he losses his mind like this...

Still , im happy for the germans, they play an awesome last match, and it was a great last match for oliver kahn,, i guess 3rd is not so bad..

GO GERMANY GO !!!!

[darylcrowe]

Heard this in our local news today. According to an unknown source Materazzi called Zidane a musilm terrorist or something which in some grave way insluted his faith.

Hmm, well the news over here, hinted that the guy insulted Zidane's mother.

[animanic_critic]

No matter what the insult was, be it racial, family or even religious; wasn't Zidane aware of the situation of the game itself? Zidane is a smart man - we all know that - but I don't blame him for being angry though. I would too, but I would give a second thought before I would like my head and give him a piece of my cranium and bring my whole team down...

...but even though it sounded far-fetched, a religious insult could have been spat at Zidane. If Zidane was insulted of his family, he could've testified in th press. Maybe he's the forgive-and-forget type of person, or that he knew if he revealed the religious incitement, it would trigger bigger problems to the community because he was a beacon for multi-racial harmony.

So far, that could be what's happening. No word from Zidane so far... I let you in with the news ASAP.

[Azrael]

Zidane is badass.

And it didn't cost him the Golden Ball. So who cares? Italy still won anyway. Go Azzurri!

[loner]

you forget one thing... it is the Zidanes and Ronaldos who sell tickets and keep people interested. That is why FIFA is considering widening the goal area (horrible idea if you ask me).

Yes... good defenders are great and all, but people go to the stadiums to see people score and have good attacking teamwork.

And for the record, soccer became popular during those times were scores were 5-4 or 7-2 or 4-2. No one denied the quality of a good attacking team ever. Just because you are a little more gung ho about it, doesn't meant that the quality will be absent. Just look at any of the Brazilian teams of the 60's and 1970.

Then we might as well hand every World Cup to Brazil from now on?

It's a horrible generalization to say that people only go to stadiums to see people score. People go to see people play football, and more important to see their teams win. It's also a generalization to say football became popular during times when scores were 5-4s, because there weren't a specific time when football became popular in each place. Football was popular in Europe long before Brazil even became a great football nation.

It's not just about being a little more gung ho. When the top scoring team gets more prizes and plaudits than the actual champions, every team will be ultra gung ho and care about attack only. It will be a slugging match. In fact, I question whether creative players like Zidane and Riquelme can flourish in this kind of game. We pay to see them because they have creativity to breach world class defences, not because they are able to rip schoolboy defences apart.

If anything, attacking players get too much credit. It's refreshing to see a World Cup where great defenders gets some plaudits.

[Tsukushi]

you forget one thing... it is the Zidanes and Ronaldos who sell tickets and keep people interested. That is why FIFA is considering widening the goal area (horrible idea if you ask me).

Yes... good defenders are great and all, but people go to the stadiums to see people score and have good attacking teamwork.

And for the record, soccer became popular during those times were scores were 5-4 or 7-2 or 4-2. No one denied the quality of a good attacking team ever. Just because you are a little more gung ho about it, doesn't meant that the quality will be absent. Just look at any of the Brazilian teams of the 60's and 1970.

Scores in football used to be higher before because the offside rule didn't exist in those days. I think they should get rid of it....

[Finnf00]

Scores in football used to be higher before because the offside rule didn't exist in those days. I think they should get rid of it....Prior to the 70´s you weren´t allowed a single substitute EVEN if a player got injured. Should we re-introduce that too? People can´t constantly look back and say footy used to be something far more exciting. I´ve seen some pretty damn good matches over the last ten years, and that´s WITH all these new rules. Players have a better physique nowadays, they´re stronger and faster and have a better tactical knowledge than before. All of this might influence the scores quite a bit, but I don´t think we should get rid of all the fit players or the good coaches for that reason.

People who only watch the World Cup and make all the conclusions based on a few international matches are completely lost. Watch a few matches of any one of the top leagues in Europe at the moment, and you´ll see plenty of very nice goals. I don´t think low scores are evident outside of the actual World Cup matches, so people who criticise the game do it based on a single tournament and that´s a bit weak. I generally see around ten Finnish, French, German and Spanish league games and around 20 Serie A and Premier League games a season on top of which I get the Champions League games and the weekly updates on all the goals from all the major Euro leagues, so I have a pretty broad perspective here. Anyone willing to challenge this view better not base their opinions on the World Cup alone.

[soundchazer]

Yeah... the problem is that for many of us, who do watch European, South American and football from other parts of the World, we still consider the World Cup to be THE football event. I like to see what a country can produce vs. what money can buy. But it doesn't work if teams are running scared and appying tactics to avoid losing rather than winning, which was the basic tennet of the teams that made it far this time.

It was telling that both teams on Sunday played with a very VERY conservative 4-5-1 strategy. Just because Henry makes 2 good runs towards the goal line, doesn't mean that the match was actually any good.

And the fact is Riquelme was a non factor this world cup, just like Ronaldinho and Zidane was a bright spot for the most part only in those matches where he was allowed to roam free (as in the match against Brazil), but when he had to face 2 or 3 defensive midfielders before making it to the other side, he was for the most part nullified. Did you count the number of forced and missed passes he had on Sunday?

And Loner, you are the one generalizing. Being more offensive minded doesn't mean you will have a "school boy" defense. Examples: Netherlands in 1998, heck... even the Netherlands from the Cruyff era, which was a scoring machine, kept the brazilians without any goals while happily going forward.

The sad part is that is there was no great team this world cup... even the champion had a lousy final (France dominated most of the match). We also didn't see really outstanding players who were consistently good throughout the world cup... no Hagis, no Stoitchkovs, no Bebeto+Romario or Bergkamp + Kluivert tandems. The best we saw was a washed up Zidane who had one good match, a good match by Pirlo and Cannavaro against Germany and a great goal by Maxi Rodriguez. That is too little thrill for the magnitude of the event. And this comes from a guy who watched live every world cup since 1978 and who also has reels with complete matches since 1966.

I think you just have been watching too much Italian football.

[Tsukushi]

Prior to the 70´s you weren´t allowed a single substitute EVEN if a player got injured. Should we re-introduce that too? People can´t constantly look back and say footy used to be something far more exciting. I´ve seen some pretty damn good matches over the last ten years, and that´s WITH all these new rules. Players have a better physique nowadays, they´re stronger and faster and have a better tactical knowledge than before. All of this might influence the scores quite a bit, but I don´t think we should get rid of all the fit players or the good coaches for that reason.

People who only watch the World Cup and make all the conclusions based on a few international matches are completely lost. Watch a few matches of any one of the top leagues in Europe at the moment, and you´ll see plenty of very nice goals. I don´t think low scores are evident outside of the actual World Cup matches, so people who criticise the game do it based on a single tournament and that´s a bit weak. I generally see around ten Finnish, French, German and Spanish league games and around 20 Serie A and Premier League games a season on top of which I get the Champions League games and the weekly updates on all the goals from all the major Euro leagues, so I have a pretty broad perspective here. Anyone willing to challenge this view better not base their opinions on the World Cup alone.

Who said that I only watch the World Cup? I just find that the offside rule occationally disqualifies some very nice goals. Voila.

[loner]

Yeah... the problem is that for many of us, who do watch European, South American and football from other parts of the World, we still consider the World Cup to be THE football event. I like to see what a country can produce vs. what money can buy. But it doesn't work if teams are running scared and appying tactics to avoid losing rather than winning, which was the basic tennet of the teams that made it far this time.

It was telling that both teams on Sunday played with a very VERY conservative 4-5-1 strategy. Just because Henry makes 2 good runs towards the goal line, doesn't mean that the match was actually any good.

And the fact is Riquelme was a non factor this world cup, just like Ronaldinho and Zidane was a bright spot for the most part only in those matches where he was allowed to roam free (as in the match against Brazil), but when he had to face 2 or 3 defensive midfielders before making it to the other side, he was for the most part nullified. Did you count the number of forced and missed passes he had on Sunday?

And Loner, you are the one generalizing. Being more offensive minded doesn't mean you will have a "school boy" defense. Examples: Netherlands in 1998, heck... even the Netherlands from the Cruyff era, which was a scoring machine, kept the brazilians without any goals while happily going forward.

The sad part is that is there was no great team this world cup... even the champion had a lousy final (France dominated most of the match). We also didn't see really outstanding players who were consistently good throughout the world cup... no Hagis, no Stoitchkovs, no Bebeto+Romario or Bergkamp + Kluivert tandems. The best we saw was a washed up Zidane who had one good match, a good match by Pirlo and Cannavaro against Germany and a great goal by Maxi Rodriguez. That is too little thrill for the magnitude of the event. And this comes from a guy who watched live every world cup since 1978 and who also has reels with complete matches since 1966.

I think you just have been watching too much Italian football.

I actually don't watch much Italian football at all. What I do watch a lot is German football, and check the stats, it's got the highest goal per game average of all top European leagues. However, i also watch Champion's League football, and appreciate seeing Thuram and Cannavaro instead of Arminia Bielefeld's defence. (I also wonder if you've watched a lot of Italian football recently, because last season the amount of goals have increased drastically and there were more high scoring games in Serie A than La Liga)

I'm not talking about encouraging attacking football, but about that plan of yours, SC, of awarding the highest scoring team more than the actual champion. And if it gets to that point, it's not just about being offensive minded. It's all about gung ho offence and no defence.

I pay to see great players yes, but I pay to see them get pass Makeleles, Vieiras, Cannavaros and Thurams then score. That's what a truly magical moment mean for me, that's what a world class goal is. If you are a world class player, then you gotta beat world class defenders, not some second division blokes. If Ronaldinho can't get by Makelele and Thuram and couldn't produce anything magical, I'm not blaming France for being too negative and doing what they obviously should do, I blame Ronaldinho for being crap that day (and throughout the tournament). Riquelme was a huge factor in the first two games actually. His passes tore the Ivorian defence apart, and he dictated the Serbian slaughter. But if he can't free himself from the shackles your own Mexicans and Germans set upon him, we should not help him free those shackles by changing the rules, we should be asking him why he wasn't able to do it when he's a world class playmaker.

I don't think there's anything wrong with the rules of the World Cup. You actually said the reason why there weren't any "thrills" this year: there weren't any really outstanding players. Ronaldinho, the only superstar in his prime in this World Cup, completely failed to show up. Others were either too old (Zidane, Figo) or too young (Rooney, Messi) to shine throughout the tournament, and only showed flashes of their genius. So my suggested solution to your woes: wait four years until the likes of Rooney and Messi have matured into this kind of great players. There were great defenders in every generation (who all unfortunately never get the plaudits they deserve). Pele, Maradona, Cruyff, Platini et al. all beat them to produce historical footy moments. There was no extra incentive of awards or change of rules by FIFA to help them score. They did it because they wanted to win the World Cup.

And on a final note, the Dutch Total Football is not just a system of total attack, but also total defence. Every player is not just an attacker, they are all also defenders. And the Dutch never won anything. They were trumped by the efficient defenders of Germany.

[Finnf00]

Who said that I only watch the World Cup? I just find that the offside rule occationally disqualifies some very nice goals. Voila.Sorry. That last paragraph wasn't aimed at you, but towards individuals who think modern football isn't as exciting as it once used to be.

[animanic_critic]

I actually don't watch much Italian football at all. What I do watch a lot is German football, and check the stats, it's got the highest goal per game average of all top European leagues. However, i also watch Champion's League football, and appreciate seeing Thuram and Cannavaro instead of Arminia Bielefeld's defence. (I also wonder if you've watched a lot of Italian football recently, because last season the amount of goals have increased drastically and there were more high scoring games in Serie A than La Liga)

I'm not talking about encouraging attacking football, but about that plan of yours, SC, of awarding the highest scoring team more than the actual champion. And if it gets to that point, it's not just about being offensive minded. It's all about gung ho offence and no defence.

I pay to see great players yes, but I pay to see them get pass Makeleles, Vieiras, Cannavaros and Thurams then score. That's what a truly magical moment mean for me, that's what a world class goal is. If you are a world class player, then you gotta beat world class defenders, not some second division blokes. If Ronaldinho can't get by Makelele and Thuram and couldn't produce anything magical, I'm not blaming France for being too negative and doing what they obviously should do, I blame Ronaldinho for being crap that day (and throughout the tournament). Riquelme was a huge factor in the first two games actually. His passes tore the Ivorian defence apart, and he dictated the Serbian slaughter. But if he can't free himself from the shackles your own Mexicans and Germans set upon him, we should not help him free those shackles by changing the rules, we should be asking him why he wasn't able to do it when he's a world class playmaker.

I don't think there's anything wrong with the rules of the World Cup. You actually said the reason why there weren't any "thrills" this year: there weren't any really outstanding players. Ronaldinho, the only superstar in his prime in this World Cup, completely failed to show up. Others were either too old (Zidane, Figo) or too young (Rooney, Messi) to shine throughout the tournament, and only showed flashes of their genius. So my suggested solution to your woes: wait four years until the likes of Rooney and Messi have matured into this kind of great players. There were great defenders in every generation (who all unfortunately never get the plaudits they deserve). Pele, Maradona, Cruyff, Platini et al. all beat them to produce historical footy moments. There was no extra incentive of awards or change of rules by FIFA to help them score. They did it because they wanted to win the World Cup.

And on a final note, the Dutch Total Football is not just a system of total attack, but also total defence. Every player is not just an attacker, they are all also defenders. And the Dutch never won anything. They were trumped by the efficient defenders of Germany.
As an avid fan of Holland, I (in fact, almost everybody of that generation) felt injustice was served during the emergence of the Dutch Total Football because, as Johan Cruyff once said, everybody was rooting Holland to win back then. It wasn't as if Germany wasn't fit to lift the cup eventually, but the Dutch team introduced a new form of football that's fresh and exciting, a game that we all would love to watch. It was really a 50-50 match; a stylish and dynamic Dutch team against a sturdy and efficient German team. Johan Cruyff remains as one of the greats who didn't win the cup... People still feel the injustice till this day...

...how I wish that form of football strives till this day. Reports showed that, apart from Italia '90, this has been the lowest-scoring tournament in history -- just 147 goals in all matches (meaning an average of 2.29 goals per match, a shy-away from 2.21 goals per match during Italia '90). What's the reason behind this statistics? Is it the rise of defenders or the fall of good strikers? Or perhaps the mental trend of today, where teams would rather "PLAY NOT TO LOSE" than to "PLAY TO WIN". This form of play (also called catenaccio), though not wrong, is quite worrisome because people inevitably want to see goals rushing in rather than tackles flushing out. And Italy, who invented catenaccio, eventually won. I'm not surprised really, why is that?

For your information, in my place, the Bundesliga isn't so popular (I wonder why?), but the English Premier League is VERY much favoured here. But deep inside, I think the Bundesliga and the French Ligue (Olympique Lyon is one heck of a fabulous team!) deserved more recognition.

As for Zidane's headbutt, the local papers here in my country said lip-readers claimed Materazzi said the likes of "son of terrorist whore" and "N**ger (racist slur)". But the news finally showed that Materazzi publicly admitted that he called Zidane, during the incident, a "dirty terrorist", but ONLY because he thought Zidane was super-arrogant. Materazzi was tugging at Zidane's shirt and the Frenchman said in frustration "If you want my shirt so much, I'll give it to you after the match!". That spurred Materazzi to make that terrorist-comment.

[loner]

Materazzi actually claimed he never made any terrorist comments, in fact going as far as saying "he's not cultured enough" to know what "Islamic terrorist means" (bullshit, but I digress). It seems what he said was actually closer to "i'll get the shirt from your wife after tonight" or something like that. Anyways, people are blowing this out of proportion because it's Zidane. Insults much, much worse than this can be heard on the football pitch every game, and the final verdict should just be this: regardless of what Materazzi said, Zidane had no right to headbutt anybody like that, and fully deserved that red card. People should just leave Materazzi alone to his celebrations now. It's not like he's done anything he hasn't done before in the past.

Italy certainly did not play catenaccio for most of this tournament. In fact, against Germany in ET, Lippi did the most un-catenaccio thing ever: throwing on 4 forwards and attacked Germany when penalties are beckoning. Would a team that's playing not to lose do something like that? They could've allowed the game to go to penalties, and judging from their penalty takers in the final they would not be afraid of such a situation, but they went for it and got the goals. Italy certainly did switch to catenaccio at times, but only when things got tough or when they are playing woefully, such as the second half against Australia when Materazzi got a red and the ET against France when all of their players were tired and Lippi used up his subs. But they used that more as a last resort and always looked to attack when there's a chance. However, they do not play fast paced football for sure like the Premiership. They are very patient and opportunistic in their attack, taking advantage of opponent's mistakes or piecing together a perfect move to score. They've scored 12 goals in 7 games. 1.71 goal per game, that's not a bad average, especially compared to say, Portugal (7 goals in 7 games, 1 goal per game), England (6 goals in 5 games, 1.2 goal per game), France (9 goals in 7 games, 1.28 goal per game) and Ukraine (5 goals in 5 games, 1 goal per game).

And you seem to be in a bit of contradiction about your criticism of defensive-minded football and your praise for the Ligue 1. The French Ligue has the lowest goal per game average in the big leagues of Europe for the past few seasons. Every week, if you check their scorelines, you'll see a handful of 0-0s. And yes, Lyon is an extremely well-run club and is only getting stronger and stronger. The fact that they've been the champions for the past, what, 6 seasons, is a quite telling of the quality of the rest of the league.

[soundchazer]

For the record Loner, I'm not asking for ANY changes to the way football is played (which you actually do). All I ask is to give teams additional incentives to play offensive football.

Think about it... does the fact that you would see a Pirlo on the opponents side of the field more often than his make Cannavaro not as good? Not really. He would have to work a bit harder, most likely, since there won't be 10 players in his side of the field defending. In fact, I think open style football would separate the really good defensive players from those who look good because of the tactics.

And don't ask me... almost every specialist agrees that this was a crappy world cup, were teams were more worried about defending themselves that winning the match. If you want names, some of the people included were Bilardo (quite an irony too), Batistuta, Bianchi, Tostao, Valdano, Mennotti, Trapattoni, etc.

I do agree though, that in plenty of matches, Italy did NOT play catenaccio, but it seems Italy had a lot of understudies, because half the teams played that way.

[Finnf00]

And you seem to be in a bit of contradiction about your criticism of defensive-minded football and your praise for the Ligue 1. The French Ligue has the lowest goal per game average in the big leagues of Europe for the past few seasons. Every week, if you check their scorelines, you'll see a handful of 0-0s. And yes, Lyon is an extremely well-run club and is only getting stronger and stronger. The fact that they've been the champions for the past, what, 6 seasons, is a quite telling of the quality of the rest of the league.The French league is in my mind one of the more entertaining ones in Europe. You never know how the results will go. The teams, thanks to their relatively small budgets, have to play a huge amount of youngsters which makes the game even more unpredictable. Despite the recent Lyon domination, it's still not as boring as say the Dutch or the Scottish leagues. At least we've seen a number of teams win the Ligue 1 over the past 30 years. :P

Most importantly though, regardless of how many goals they score per average, the game is entertaining to watch.

[loner]

Maybe if the monetary prizes were higher for the highest scoring team than those of the champion, maybe some teams would be more inclined to be looking to defend less and attack more.

That won't change the way football is played?

It's fine that people like Trappattoni and Bianchi think that this World Cup wasn't up to their standards. Frankly, I could care less about these "specialists" think, since I am not going to let them tell me how football should be played. I'll decide how enjoyable the games are myself, I'll decide myself if the games were entertaining. I also find it funny you mentioned the name Trappattoni, one of the most conservative coaches in the world.

Anyways, where Pirlo plays doesn't matter, since he can't tackle and is generally a defensive liability. That's why he's almost never on the field without Gattuso. He stays on his own half of the field because that's where he likes to operate offensively.

The majority of Italy's "understudies" went out in the first round. The most catenaccio side in this World Cup, Serbia and Montenegro, was slaughtered, while others such as Croatia and Poland also went out quickly. Only Switzerland defended their way to the round of 16, but their inability to score went all the way to penalties. Other teams couldn't score because they failed Attacking 101 (England), or their strikers left their scoring boots in their own country (Portugal).

Maca, I suppose the unpredictability does make the games fun in a way, but there's seldom real quality on show. You can get a lot of unpredictability and youngsters in English Division 2 as well. But I won't argue that Ligue 1 is more worth watching than the Dutch and Scottish leagues. since these leagues really only have a few games per season that anybody besides Dutchmen and Scots would even care about. Lyon does have some very good players that I would pay to watch though, like Juninho, Diarra and Malouda (and now Toulalan and Kallstrom...)

[Tsukushi]

Sorry. That last paragraph wasn't aimed at you, but towards individuals who think modern football isn't as exciting as it once used to be.

Hehe. That's ok. Football is definitely as exciting as it used to be :)

[Finnf00]

Maca, I suppose the unpredictability does make the games fun in a way, but there's seldom real quality on show. You can get a lot of unpredictability and youngsters in English Division 2 as well. The thing is, these youngsters -unlike the ones you see in the lower divisions- are actually very talented, and can produce some really impressive plays. Not a week goes by without another 17 year old blasting in goals from 30 yards out. Of course they also make more mistakes than the senior players, but it´s this kind of courage to try just about anything which makes the game very entertaining to watch. It can also throw the results around quite a bit, and since the game tends to fluctuate throughout the 90 minutes of play you never know how it´ll end. I know the skill level might not be as high as in some of the other big leagues in Europe, but I do believe the French league is he most prominent breeding ground for future star players at the moment.

[soundchazer]

That won't change the way football is played?



It changes the motivation, but it doesn't change the nature of the game itself. Having replay would change the game itself. It would make a match last longer, and would cut the flow of the match more than a couple of arguments with the referee.

And don't misunderstand me... I'm not saying football today is not as exciting as football in the past, at least it is not the case at club level, but I am worried that on the national team level, tactics are overwhelming skill. Skill is what sells tickets. It is sad when teams with talent rely on the easiest way out (destroying advances) than creating scoring opportunities. While you may say that England forgot attacking football 101, I disagree. when you start a match in a 5-4-1 formation, or even a 4-4-2 but you ask 1 of your forwards to be half of the match in their own side of the field, you can't call that offensive football.

I really hope this was just a hiccup in world cup history, but this is starting to become a trend that started with 1990 and that has been pervasive in various degrees in every world cup ever since.

[loner]

When teams can win more by scoring more goals then actually winning games, then the game has really changed. Like I said, a team could score the most goals and go out in the group stage, and still end up as the World Cup winners. World Cup is not just a display of players from different nation, but also various playing styles. Purely encouraging only one style destroys this variety and make football much less colorful.

As it is, the flow of the game is already seriously disrupted every time a player goes down faking injury or there is a controversial sending off with every player surrounding the ref to argue all day. I don't think it will really stop the flow much more than it is already being stopped to quickly check replays in one or two crucial situations. There is already a fifth referee at this World Cup in a video booth checking replays, but he's not allowed to interfere with anything. All FIFA needs to do is give the fifth ref a microphone so he can communicate with the first ref, and set a time limit on how long it should take before a decision is made. Anyways, diving and playacting will hurt the game more than any technological interference will. If this won't do, then maybe a second ref on the field? Refs behind the goal?

England's switch from 4-4-2 to 4-5-1, believe it or not, was actually a move to create more offence. Eriksson shot himself on the foot when he only called up 4 strikers, 2 of which just coming back from injuries and one he was unwilling to use. England do have two world class midfielders in Gerrard and Lampard who gallop up and down for their clubs scoring around 20 goals per season per person. In a 4-4-2 it was suggested that the two central midfielders were confused as to who should be attacking and who should be defending, so England end up failing at attack. So Sven slotted in a defensive specialist to do all the dirty work, so both Gerrard and Lampard are free to attack whenever they want. The extra striker was dropped since he was most ineffective anyways. However, that plan went totally kaput because both Gerrard and Lampard completely failed to deliver anything and still ended up confused. Lampard adopted a shoot on sight policy and contributed nothing substantial, while Gerrard was out of sync with the rest of the team for majority of the time. Therefore, you have all the misplaced passes and a frustrated Rooney.

Anyways, I don't see how tactics overwhelming skills is anything dangerous, when I go to see that "skill" because it can break the "tactics". Nobody used any new profound tactics that can completely stifled all flair. Guys like Lippi, Domenech and Scolari all used tricks that we've all seen before. It's just that the "skills" didn't show up themselves. There have been much more negative "catenaccio" in the past than anything we're seeing today, and skillful maestros have overcame them to produce some of the most magical moments in history.

[Azrael]

Couldn't we just chalk the confusion up to typical jock stupidity?

Did Eriksson ever blatantly say to Lampard and Gerrard "Hey, you two! Run up and attack!" Maybe. But we can't know that. But I agree on your reasons for the early departure of England. Rooney's frustration with the complete and utter incompetence of most of his team is probably part of the reason why he stomped Carvahlo's nuts.

But why are we talking about the British when Zizou is going to announce what Materazzi said to him later on today? I think this is far more awesome. Some of the translations from people lip-reading Materazzi are pretty shocking indeed.

[soundchazer]

When teams can win more by scoring more goals then actually winning games, then the game has really changed. Like I said, a team could score the most goals and go out in the group stage, and still end up as the World Cup winners. World Cup is not just a display of players from different nation, but also various playing styles. Purely encouraging only one style destroys this variety and make football much less colorful.

Careful there... I never said they would be the winners! I just said they would be compensated for it monetarily. They are not going to lift the cup, nor are they going to have a better ranking, nor will that decide wether or not they will be appointed as the head of a group. I simply say they get more than "a moral victory" out of it for trying to be spectacular and offensive minded. You are just overthinking that idea too much and assuming things it does not cover.

As it is, the flow of the game is already seriously disrupted every time a player goes down faking injury or there is a controversial sending off with every player surrounding the ref to argue all day. I don't think it will really stop the flow much more than it is already being stopped to quickly check replays in one or two crucial situations. There is already a fifth referee at this World Cup in a video booth checking replays, but he's not allowed to interfere with anything. All FIFA needs to do is give the fifth ref a microphone so he can communicate with the first ref, and set a time limit on how long it should take before a decision is made. Anyways, diving and playacting will hurt the game more than any technological interference will. If this won't do, then maybe a second ref on the field? Refs behind the goal?


I like the idea of 2 referees better, because they would be closer to the play. Unfortunately, the only problem would be the difference in criteria. But then again, we already have that going with the line judges. It wouldn't change the flow of the match though, like replay would. Think about it... you have a controversial play... players argue... play is stopped for review... a decision is reached... players will continue to argue the call. You added even more time to the decision-making process than it take on a regular basis.

I have a couple of other ideas to help out: either eliminate extra-time to keep players fresh for following matches, or add a 4th substitution, only to be used during extra time if reached. And I would also go back to the old rule where a Goalkeeper who has to leave hurt can be substituted without counting towards the 3 substitutions.

[animanic_critic]

I like the idea of 2 referees better, because they would be closer to the play. Unfortunately, the only problem would be the difference in criteria. But then again, we already have that going with the line judges. It wouldn't change the flow of the match though, like replay would. Think about it... you have a controversial play... players argue... play is stopped for review... a decision is reached... players will continue to argue the call. You added even more time to the decision-making process than it take on a regular basis.

I have a couple of other ideas to help out: either eliminate extra-time to keep players fresh for following matches, or add a 4th substitution, only to be used during extra time if reached. And I would also go back to the old rule where a Goalkeeper who has to leave hurt can be substituted without counting towards the 3 substitutions.
WHOA, I heard about this idea too, one that FIFA President had presumably proposed. I REALLY don't think this method would work. Video replay is still a valid option, but utilising 2 referees obviously changes the way football is played. What's the reason behind the proposal - better judgment in overall? Not always. The current sole referee does have to oversee the entire field, unlike the 2 referees which watch would oversee only his half of the pitch, but think about it:

If an incident is to happen, let's say, on Referee #1's side of the pitch, does that means that only Referee #1 will have the right to pass the judgment? What about Referee #2? Does he have any say in it? Just because it happened in Referee #1's side doesn't mean he would have the final verdict, because although technically Referee #1 may be closer to the incident than Referee #2, he may not be obviously the one who saw it more clearly. Maybe he saw the incident valid for a yellow card, BUT ONLY from HIS position. Referee #2, though farther, may have a better position of witnessing the incident and say that it is not valid for a yellow card. At the end of the day, the referee only has 2 eyes compared to the 100,000 eyes of the spectators who is likely to have seen everything...

... the main problem to 2 referees is the authority of who gets to pass the final decision and the capability to give the better judgment. It's just like in a courtroom: The jury may have many people, but video replays and linesmen should take on their similar roles on the pitch. I don't see 2 judges on the same courtroom at all, and neither can I see 2 referees on the same pitch.

[loner]

Careful there... I never said they would be the winners! I just said they would be compensated for it monetarily. They are not going to lift the cup, nor are they going to have a better ranking, nor will that decide wether or not they will be appointed as the head of a group. I simply say they get more than "a moral victory" out of it for trying to be spectacular and offensive minded. You are just overthinking that idea too much and assuming things it does not cover.


For majority of teams, that's to say not the elite teams like Italy, Brazil, France, England, etc., their players only really care about the monetary awards. Think about Togo and how they nearly boycotted their once-in-a-lifetime chance to play in a World Cup. They don't care about winning the Cup because they know they can't win it anyways, and they certainly won't care about world rankings since it's a huge mess right now anyways. So they get a moral victory, which to them is a complete victory, for playing sloppy, lousy at the back only because they went gung ho against teams like Saudi Arabia and grabbed a bunch of goals?

Majority of football players today are money-grabbers, not "honest professionals". When the actual winner gets less money than some random team that managed to score 10 goals against Saudi Arabia, how do you think the Cup winners will feel?

[soundchazer]

Of course, the fact that they have more opportunities to score because they have more matches to play in has no bearing on the issue, right? Usually, the leading scorer makes it at the very least to quarterfinals, and more often than not, plays within the top 4 teams of the competition.

A good example that exemplifies how your fear usually doesn't come to pass is Spain 1982. Hungary scored ten goals against El Salvador. Did they en up scoring the most goals in the tournament? No, even though they ended up with 12. Why? Because they didn't even make it to the next round. So you still need balance in your team. The most successful attacking teams are not the ones who go Gung Ho about it. Remember... you need to have the ball to score, and that usually means that your defensive midfielders and defenders have to get it and serve it to the forwards.